A Chat with Tangled Directors Byron Howard and Nathan Greno Part 2

Here’s part two of my chat with Tangled directors Byron Howard (Lilo & Stitch, Brother Bear) and Nathan Greno(Bolt, Prep & Landing). Enjoy!

What were three main challenges you faced making Tangled?

Nathan Greno: The schedule was terrible. Usually you have 4 to 5 years to make one of these films. We only had 2. It was crazy. Lucky for us, we were working with a very devoted, hard working, talented crew. We all worked around the clock. We worked through weekends and holidays. We all believed in this film. We basically did the impossible. The film looks like it took 5 years to make… and it only took 2!

2010 was really, according to many, a great year for animated movies… Were you a little bit disappointed when that movie wasn’t nominated for an Oscar. Especially this year, where many claimed that there should have been five nominees.

Byron Howard: Yes, we were initially very disappointed when TANGLED didn’t recieve an Oscar nomination for Best Animated Feature. However, the day before the Oscar announcements we had shown the film at the Great Ormond Street Hospital for Children in London, and the reaction from those kids and their parents is worth more to us than one million Oscars.

Seven years of research went into the creation of Rapunzel’s hair. Were you satisfied with the final result?

Nathan Greno: Without a doubt, YES! The hair looks amazing. You’ve never seen anything like it in any animated film. It’s just incredible. I have no idea how our tech crew made that hair work. I know it was a nightmare to figure out. I couldn’t be more proud of the results and of our team. They did a great job.

Do you know how many layers of animation were involved to create Rapunzel’s hair?

Byron Howard: Rapunzel’s amazing head of hair has over 100,000 strands.

How was working on Tangled different to working on Bolt?

Nathan Greno: For Bolt I oversaw the story department. I worked with a team of artists – we came up with story and character ideas and sent them on to the next department. On Tangled, I am one of the directors. I now get to follow those story ideas through the creative process. I love my job. I still get to storyboard from time to time… I’d never want to give that up.

Family plays a very strong role in this film. What prompted you to explore the mother/daughter dynamic through the character of Rapunzel?

Byron Howard: Nathan and I were fascinated by this bizarre relationship that Gothel had created between herself and this kidnapped girl. To try to find out more about mother/daughter relationships, we asked a bunch of women from our studio to stay after one evening to have a chat about their relationships with their mothers. It turned into a therapy session! We were amazed at how brutal some of the things that their mothers would say to these women, but it was always coming from a place of “I know what’s best for you” or “I’m trying to keep you safe”. This push/pull that happens between parents and children is a rich, rich area to explore with classic tales like this.

Do you think that home viewers will miss out on some of the delights of seeing “Tangled” on the big screen with all the bells and whistles?

Byron Howard: The Blu-Ray looks extraordinary, so beauty-wise, I think the experience will echo the theater experience nicely. I do think there will always be something about viewing a film in an audience, hearing people all around you laugh, cry, and react to the story playing out in front of you. It’s a social, human thing that I don’t think will ever go away completely.

Why do you think it’s easier for some to look at stylized characters like the ones in “Tangled” instead of the motion capture ones like in “Polar Express?”

Nathan Greno: I personally enjoy the more stylized design because it’s not reality… if done well, it’s better than reality. You have more control over the appeal of the characters. I see the real world everyday, it’s fun to watch a movie and be taken on a journey that feels believable… but isn’t real. It’s all a matter of taste, but I really like stylized characters better. It’s just more fun.

How did you arrive at 70 feet of hair for Rapunzel? Is that length something that you guys settled on after some visual tests? Or is that how long someone’s hair would get if they didn’t actually cut it for 18 years?

Byron Howard: Actually, seventy feet is how long the hair had to be to reach the bottom of the tower. It was that simple. That said, there are times in the film where we add or subtract a little length depending on the needs of the scene.

Are there any hidden nods to other films included in Tangled that you can tell us to look out for?

Byron Howard: Look for Pinocchio hidden in the pub and in Rapunzel’s tower, each newell post on her staircase is painted with the symbol of Disney’s previous five princesses.

What advice do you have for kids who dream on one day directing?

Nathan Greno: Go for it! I grew up in a small, factory town in Wisconsin. It took a long time to get where I am, but I worked very hard and my dream came true. It’s possible to do whatever you want in life if you work hard enough.

At what age did you decide you’d like to work with Disney?

Nathan Greno: I was in 1st grade! That was a looong time ago…

The scene in the gondolas is a show-stopper. Where did the idea of the lanterns come from?

Byron Howard: The idea for the lantern scene came from John Ripa, one of our story artists. We needed something that Rapunzel could see from miles away, locked up in her tower, that would draw her out to the kingdom. We thought “Fireworks?” But that didn’t seem quite right. Then John mentioned this lantern ceremony that they do in Indonesia. We brought it up on YouTube and that was it, we knew that had to be in the movie. It’s perfect for CG as well, because we can actually create thirty to forty thousand of these beautiful things for the audience to marvel at.

How were you, as a storyboard director, considered as another director for Tangled?

Nathan Greno: John Lasseter asked me to direct the BOLT DVD short film. Byron helped me on that short — there were departments I never worked in before and Byron showed me the ropes. Lasseter really liked the job I did on the short and asked if I would like to direct a Rapunzel film for the studio. Yes! Of course! He asked if I would like to direct with anyone or by myself. I asked for Byron. Byron said yes… and today we have Tangled!

How was directing this feature with another director beside you? Were there any difficulties or is it a normal occurrence?

Byron Howard: I really prefer directing as part of a team. Nathan and I have very good chemistry together and we are constantly pushing each other to make sure the film is as good as it can be. The thing that saves us from any huge disagreements is our shared philosophy that whatever is best for the story, wins.

“Hi everyone, thanks for the tons of questions! We are trying to get to as many as we can in the next 20 minutes. To help that along we will stop receiving new questions now and work to answer the ones already submitted.”

Why do you think you were able to get boys interested in a “Disney Princess” film?

Nathan Greno: Mostly because I don’t feel we made a “princess film”. Honestly, I feel we made a movie that has princess elements in it — but I wouldn’t call it a princess film. Tangled has a ton of action, a ton of humor, a ton of heart and emotion. It’s a film for everyone. Yes, we have a princess… but she doesn’t know she’s a princess. It was easy to get boys interested in the movie because we made a movie for everyone to enjoy.

Other than Tangled, what is your favorite Disney movie?

Nathan Greno: I love Dumbo! Best. Film. Ever.

What were three main challenges you faced making Tangled?

Byron Howard: 1. The schedule 2. The schedule 3. The schedule. Honestly, the film was challenging in a hundred ways, but the fact that we had to make this film in half the time of other features was the real bear. Happily, the film looks more amazing than we could’ve ever hoped for, but our poor crew really took a beating trying to hit those deadlines with Nathan and myself being so slavish to quality. We love our crew, and the fact that their work has made such a splash in the world really justifies all their hard work and sacrifice.

Did you get much sleep throughout the making of Tangled?

Nathan Greno: Zzzzzzz… what? Sorry. I missed the question…

Was there a character that was initially in the story, but was removed because they no longer fit within the story?

Byron Howard: We had a fortune-telling monkey that was very popular, but eventually we found that he wasn’t part of where the story needed to go. You can see a hint of him in the end credits.

Do you think you and Byron will become a directing duo from now on?

Nathan Greno: We already pitched new ideas to our boss, John Lasseter and we are currently working as a team developing one of those ideas into a feature film. So… YES!

Who thought up Flynn’s “smoulder” face? Was it based on anyone in particular?

Byron Howard: The smoulder is based on my directing buddy, Nathan. He has a way with the ladies.

Nine versions of Rapunzel were created before you settled on the final version. What were some of the other versions like?

Nathan Greno: Really? Nine? The idea of a Rapunzel movie has been around the Disney Animation Studio since the 1930’s… I bet there has been more than nine.

Who came up with the idea of the Rapunzel emotional whipsaw scene, where she’s jubilant to be out of her tower one moment and in tears because she’s betraying her mother’s trust the next. As any parent of a daughter will tell you, that moment in the movie such Rapunzel such a real. relateable character. So who came up with that story concept?

Byron Howard: That scene was storyboarded by story artist Marc Smith. That was one of the earliest scene we boarded in the film and it held fast as one of the key moments for the audience to connect with this young woman. Many people have commented on how true-to life that scene is.

What is your favorite song in Tangled?

Nathan Greno: I really love them all. I guess if I had to pick one… I would go with the pub song “I’ve Got a Dream”. It’s just silly and fun and crazy. It’s always wild to watch.

There’s some concept art in “The Art of Tangled” that shows Rapunzel’s love interest as more of a muscular commoner / farm boy, rather than a handsome rogue like Flynn Rider. Was this story idea seriously explored? Or just something that was considered?

Byron Howard: The burlier leading man was from a previous version of the movie. Nathan and I knew we wanted a dashing thief from the get-go, so Flynn, as you see him in the movie, evolved from that idea. And also from the “Hot Man Meeting” where we asked dozens of women at the studio to bring in pictures of their favorite hunky men to help us design Flynn. Being a guy in that meeting was brutal. Those ladies have high standards!

What was your favorite animated film growing up, has it inspired you up and until today?

Byron Howard: The animated film that made me want to be an animator was THE LITTLE MERMAID. Ariel was the first Disney heroine I had ever seen where there seemed to be a real soul behind those eyes. As soon as I saw that film, I knew I wanted to be a part of Disney Animation. Little did I know that I’d wind up working on TANGLED with Ariel’s creator, legendary animator Glen Keane. Life’s good.

How was the did the idea for “hot man” meetings come up?

Nathan Greno: We had a great design for Rapunzel. She was super cute and incredibly appealing. We needed Flynn to be up to that level, so we had this crazy idea to bring all of the women of the studio into a room and ask them what they thought made up a “hot man”. It was a crazy meeting. Crazy. Photos of all the hottest men in Hollywood being thrown around a room. Photos being torn in half and pasted back together. Eyes were ripped from one picture and put on another. Heads were torn from photos. I’ve never seen anything like it. I’m happy to be alive.

In what way was Rapunzel inspired by Ariel in The Little Mermaid?

Byron Howard: I think Rapunzel is like Ariel in that they come across as very real young women. That was very important to us for Rapunzel, because the more you can relate and identify with these characters, the greater your emotional response will be to the journey that they take on screen.

Was Flynn’s facial hair based off your own?

Nathan Greno: It was in my contract… one of the Tangled characters had to have my facial hair.

Had you two ever worked together on a film before? You two seem to work very well together.

Nathan Greno: We fight all the time when the cameras are off. Nah. We get along really well. It’s hard to find someone you can work with everyday. I guess we got lucky.

How do you think Tangled has changed the future of Disney films?

Byron Howard: I think that TANGLED proves that this studio can make smart, contemporary films that still retain everything that the audience loves about traditional Disney filmmaking. The slate of upcoming projects coming up from our studio excites me because they’re not what you would expect. It’s a great time to be a part of this studio.

What is your favorite song in Tangled?

Byron Howard: Mine personally, is “I See the Light”. The moment we heard Alan Menken’s demo we knew that one would be a classic.

Were there any traits in Rapunzel that were directly from Mandy Moore such as her being barefoot constantly, or the short brown hair at the end of the film?

Byron Howard: Mandy and Rapunzel definitely have similarities. They’re both incredibly smart, funny, artistic young women, and unbeknownst to us, Mandy jumps out of airplanes! Just like Rapunzel leaps off cliffs and swings from the rafters. Adventurous young women as well.

How involved is John Lasseter during the whole process?

Nathan Greno: John has to approve everything we do and that guy only wants the best. It’s amazing working with him. I’ve learned a lot from John. He lets you get your vision of the film up on the screen… and he brings out the best in you and your work. What could be better?

What advice would you give to people who want to break into the entertainment industry?

Byron Howard: Do what you love and do it with passion. Passionate people really push every industry ahead, including animation.

Did you get much sleep throughout the making of Tangled?

Byron Howard: Nope.

BOTH: How long did you need to prep for the roles of Thug #1 and #2 and Guard #1 and #2

Nathan Greno: It takes YEARS of practice to pull off roles like “Thug #1” and “Guard #1”. Kids, please don’t try that at home.

Do you know how many layers of animation were involved to create Rapunzel’s hair?

Byron Howard: Rapunzel’s amazing head of hair has over 100,000 strands.

What were three main challenges you faced making Tangled?

Nathan Greno: The schedule was terrible. Usually you have 4 to 5 years to make one of these films. We only had 2. It was crazy. Lucky for us, we were working with a very devoted, hard working, talented crew. We all worked around the clock. We worked through weekends and holidays. We all believed in this film. We basically did the impossible. The film looks like it took 5 years to make… and it only took 2!

2010 was really, according to many, a great year for animated movies… Were you a little bit disappointed when that movie wasn’t nominated for an Oscar. Especially this year, where many claimed that there should have been five nominees.

Byron Howard: Yes, we were initially very disappointed when TANGLED didn’t recieve an Oscar nomination for Best Animated Feature. However, the day before the Oscar announcements we had shown the film at the Great Ormond Street Hospital for Children in London, and the reaction from those kids and their parents is worth more to us than one million Oscars.

Seven years of research went into the creation of Rapunzel’s hair. Were you satisfied with the final result?

Nathan Greno: Without a doubt, YES! The hair looks amazing. You’ve never seen anything like it in any animated film. It’s just incredible. I have no idea how our tech crew made that hair work. I know it was a nightmare to figure out. I couldn’t be more proud of the results and of our team. They did a great job.

How was working on Tangled different to working on Bolt?

Nathan Greno: For Bolt I oversaw the story department. I worked with a team of artists – we came up with story and character ideas and sent them on to the next department. On Tangled, I am one of the directors. I now get to follow those story ideas through the creative process. I love my job. I still get to storyboard from time to time… I’d never want to give that up.

Family plays a very strong role in this film. What prompted you to explore the mother/daughter dynamic through the character of Rapunzel?

Byron Howard: Nathan and I were fascinated by this bizarre relationship that Gothel had created between herself and this kidnapped girl. To try to find out more about mother/daughter relationships, we asked a bunch of women from our studio to stay after one evening to have a chat about their relationships with their mothers. It turned into a therapy session! We were amazed at how brutal some of the things that their mothers would say to these women, but it was always coming from a place of “I know what’s best for you” or “I’m trying to keep you safe”. This push/pull that happens between parents and children is a rich, rich area to explore with classic tales like this.

Do you think that home viewers will miss out on some of the delights of seeing “Tangled” on the big screen with all the bells and whistles?

Byron Howard: The Blu-Ray looks extraordinary, so beauty-wise, I think the experience will echo the theater experience nicely. I do think there will always be something about viewing a film in an audience, hearing people all around you laugh, cry, and react to the story playing out in front of you. It’s a social, human thing that I don’t think will ever go away completely.

Why do you think it’s easier for some to look at stylized characters like the ones in “Tangled” instead of the motion capture ones like in “Polar Express?”

Nathan Greno: I personally enjoy the more stylized design because it’s not reality… if done well, it’s better than reality. You have more control over the appeal of the characters. I see the real world everyday, it’s fun to watch a movie and be taken on a journey that feels believable… but isn’t real. It’s all a matter of taste, but I really like stylized characters better. It’s just more fun.

How did you arrive at 70 feet of hair for Rapunzel? Is that length something that you guys settled on after some visual tests? Or is that how long someone’s hair would get if they didn’t actually cut it for 18 years?

Byron Howard: Actually, seventy feet is how long the hair had to be to reach the bottom of the tower. It was that simple. That said, there are times in the film where we add or subtract a little length depending on the needs of the scene.

Are there any hidden nods to other films included in Tangled that you can tell us to look out for?

Byron Howard: Look for Pinocchio hidden in the pub and in Rapunzel’s tower, each newell post on her staircase is painted with the symbol of Disney’s previous five princesses.

What advice do you have for kids who dream on one day directing?

Nathan Greno: Go for it! I grew up in a small, factory town in Wisconsin. It took a long time to get where I am, but I worked very hard and my dream came true. It’s possible to do whatever you want in life if you work hard enough.

At what age did you decide you’d like to work with Disney?

Nathan Greno: I was in 1st grade! That was a looong time ago…

The scene in the gondolas is a show-stopper. Where did the idea of the lanterns come from?

Byron Howard: The idea for the lantern scene came from John Ripa, one of our story artists. We needed something that Rapunzel could see from miles away, locked up in her tower, that would draw her out to the kingdom. We thought “Fireworks?” But that didn’t seem quite right. Then John mentioned this lantern ceremony that they do in Indonesia. We brought it up on YouTube and that was it, we knew that had to be in the movie. It’s perfect for CG as well, because we can actually create thirty to forty thousand of these beautiful things for the audience to marvel at.

How were you, as a storyboard director, considered as another director for Tangled?

Nathan Greno: John Lasseter asked me to direct the BOLT DVD short film. Byron helped me on that short — there were departments I never worked in before and Byron showed me the ropes. Lasseter really liked the job I did on the short and asked if I would like to direct a Rapunzel film for the studio. Yes! Of course! He asked if I would like to direct with anyone or by myself. I asked for Byron. Byron said yes… and today we have Tangled!

How was directing this feature with another director beside you? Were there any difficulties or is it a normal occurrence?

Byron Howard: I really prefer directing as part of a team. Nathan and I have very good chemistry together and we are constantly pushing each other to make sure the film is as good as it can be. The thing that saves us from any huge disagreements is our shared philosophy that whatever is best for the story, wins.

“Hi everyone, thanks for the tons of questions! We are trying to get to as many as we can in the next 20 minutes. To help that along we will stop receiving new questions now and work to answer the ones already submitted.”

Why do you think you were able to get boys interested in a “Disney Princess” film?

Nathan Greno: Mostly because I don’t feel we made a “princess film”. Honestly, I feel we made a movie that has princess elements in it — but I wouldn’t call it a princess film. Tangled has a ton of action, a ton of humor, a ton of heart and emotion. It’s a film for everyone. Yes, we have a princess… but she doesn’t know she’s a princess. It was easy to get boys interested in the movie because we made a movie for everyone to enjoy.

Other than Tangled, what is your favorite Disney movie?

Nathan Greno: I love Dumbo! Best. Film. Ever.

What were three main challenges you faced making Tangled?

Byron Howard: 1. The schedule 2. The schedule 3. The schedule. Honestly, the film was challenging in a hundred ways, but the fact that we had to make this film in half the time of other features was the real bear. Happily, the film looks more amazing than we could’ve ever hoped for, but our poor crew really took a beating trying to hit those deadlines with Nathan and myself being so slavish to quality. We love our crew, and the fact that their work has made such a splash in the world really justifies all their hard work and sacrifice.

Did you get much sleep throughout the making of Tangled?

Nathan Greno: Zzzzzzz… what? Sorry. I missed the question…

Was there a character that was initially in the story, but was removed because they no longer fit within the story?

Byron Howard: We had a fortune-telling monkey that was very popular, but eventually we found that he wasn’t part of where the story needed to go. You can see a hint of him in the end credits.

Do you think you and Byron will become a directing duo from now on?

Nathan Greno: We already pitched new ideas to our boss, John Lasseter and we are currently working as a team developing one of those ideas into a feature film. So… YES!

Who thought up Flynn’s “smoulder” face? Was it based on anyone in particular?

Byron Howard: The smoulder is based on my directing buddy, Nathan. He has a way with the ladies.

Was Flynn’s facial hair based off your own?

Nathan Greno: It was in my contract… one of the Tangled characters had to have my facial hair.

Nathan Greno: Really? Nine? The idea of a Rapunzel movie has been around the Disney Animation Studio since the 1930’s… I bet there has been more than nine.

Who came up with the idea of the Rapunzel emotional whipsaw scene, where she’s jubilant to be out of her tower one moment and in tears because she’s betraying her mother’s trust the next. As any parent of a daughter will tell you, that moment in the movie such Rapunzel such a real. relateable character. So who came up with that story concept?

Byron Howard: That scene was storyboarded by story artist Marc Smith. That was one of the earliest scene we boarded in the film and it held fast as one of the key moments for the audience to connect with this young woman. Many people have commented on how true-to life that scene is.

What is your favorite song in Tangled?

Nathan Greno: I really love them all. I guess if I had to pick one… I would go with the pub song “I’ve Got a Dream”. It’s just silly and fun and crazy. It’s always wild to watch.

There’s some concept art in “The Art of Tangled” that shows Rapunzel’s love interest as more of a muscular commoner / farm boy, rather than a handsome rogue like Flynn Rider. Was this story idea seriously explored? Or just something that was considered?

Byron Howard: The burlier leading man was from a previous version of the movie. Nathan and I knew we wanted a dashing thief from the get-go, so Flynn, as you see him in the movie, evolved from that idea. And also from the “Hot Man Meeting” where we asked dozens of women at the studio to bring in pictures of their favorite hunky men to help us design Flynn. Being a guy in that meeting was brutal. Those ladies have high standards!

What was your favorite animated film growing up, has it inspired you up and until today?

Byron Howard: The animated film that made me want to be an animator was THE LITTLE MERMAID. Ariel was the first Disney heroine I had ever seen where there seemed to be a real soul behind those eyes. As soon as I saw that film, I knew I wanted to be a part of Disney Animation. Little did I know that I’d wind up working on TANGLED with Ariel’s creator, legendary animator Glen Keane. Life’s good.

How was the did the idea for “hot man” meetings come up?

Nathan Greno: We had a great design for Rapunzel. She was super cute and incredibly appealing. We needed Flynn to be up to that level, so we had this crazy idea to bring all of the women of the studio into a room and ask them what they thought made up a “hot man”. It was a crazy meeting. Crazy. Photos of all the hottest men in Hollywood being thrown around a room. Photos being torn in half and pasted back together. Eyes were ripped from one picture and put on another. Heads were torn from photos. I’ve never seen anything like it. I’m happy to be alive.

In what way was Rapunzel inspired by Ariel in The Little Mermaid?

Byron Howard: I think Rapunzel is like Ariel in that they come across as very real young women. That was very important to us for Rapunzel, because the more you can relate and identify with these characters, the greater your emotional response will be to the journey that they take on screen.

Had you two ever worked together on a film before? You two seem to work very well together.

Nathan Greno: We fight all the time when the cameras are off. Nah. We get along really well. It’s hard to find someone you can work with everyday. I guess we got lucky.

What is your favorite song in Tangled?

Byron Howard: Mine personally, is “I See the Light”. The moment we heard Alan Menken’s demo we knew that one would be a classic.

Were there any traits in Rapunzel that were directly from Mandy Moore such as her being barefoot constantly, or the short brown hair at the end of the film?

Byron Howard: Mandy and Rapunzel definitely have similarities. They’re both incredibly smart, funny, artistic young women, and unbeknownst to us, Mandy jumps out of airplanes! Just like Rapunzel leaps off cliffs and swings from the rafters. Adventurous young women as well.

How involved is John Lasseter during the whole process?

Nathan Greno: John has to approve everything we do and that guy only wants the best. It’s amazing working with him. I’ve learned a lot from John. He lets you get your vision of the film up on the screen… and he brings out the best in you and your work. What could be better?

What advice would you give to people who want to break into the entertainment industry?

Byron Howard: Do what you love and do it with passion. Passionate people really push every industry ahead, including animation.

Did you get much sleep throughout the making of Tangled?

Byron Howard: Nope.

BOTH: How long did you need to prep for the roles of Thug #1 and #2 and Guard #1 and #2

Nathan Greno: It takes YEARS of practice to pull off roles like “Thug #1” and “Guard #1”. Kids, please don’t try that at home.

How do you think Rapunzel stacks up against the long line of Disney princesses? And what do you think she’s brought to the table which is fresh or new?

Nathan Greno: Rapunzel is the most modern of all the Disney Princesses. She is full of GIRL POWER. We love that about her. She doesn’t wait around to be rescued. She takes matters into her own hands. She’s a fun, funny and silly girl. She’s very talented and smart. We wanted to make a role model for modern kids. We were really happy with the way she turned out.

Was Tangled always going to be Disney’s 50th animation film? Or, did it just come about like that?

Byron Howard: It was a big surprise to us that we were Disney Animation’s fiftieth animated feature. It added more pressure for sure, but we love that our film holds that important place in Disney history.

How do you think Tangled has changed the future of Disney films?

Byron Howard: I think that TANGLED proves that this studio can make smart, contemporary films that still retain everything that the audience loves about traditional Disney filmmaking. The slate of upcoming projects coming up from our studio excites me because they’re not what you would expect. It’s a great time to be a part of this studio.

Tangled, The Walt Disney Studios blockbuster animated feature that takes a modern twist on the famous hair-raising fable Rapunzel, debuts as the ultimate 4-Disc Disney Blu-ray Combo Pack (3D Blu-ray + Blu-ray + DVD + Digital Copy in a single package) on March 29, 2011.